Re: Hinduizam - religija milosrđa i humanosti

by Trinity 4/7/2014, 11:59

Nedjeljom samo u 10?

by Trinity 4/7/2014, 12:00

Patriot_1 wrote:
Trinity wrote:Ok, ovako napisano izgleda bezazleno. Mene zanima kako oni žive u praksi, kakvi su prema drugim religijama, i da...ono o ženama...onako je kako je bogomdani napisao?
Prijatelj mi je novinar,radio neku reportažu u Indiji,napravio grdnu grešku,poveo ženu!U par navrata imao gadnu frku,likovi ju zgrabe I ljube,,,u usta(MEDNA),,jedva ju obranio da ju ne siluju,,usred grada!Krava je tamo,vrednija od žene!

A ništa onda, sav moj interes za hinduizam tu prestaje...

by Sefirot 4/7/2014, 12:18

Patriot_1 wrote:
von_Starhemberg wrote:
Vegvísir wrote:
Patriot_1 wrote:Hinduizam je smeće!Imaju bogova vise nego grobova!A Bog je jedan i jedini!Ili bolje,,,trojedan!

Iz knjige Vjerske zajednice u Hrvatskoj, poglavlje Hinduistička vjerska zajednica Hrvatske, str. 395.

Koncept Boga. Hinduizam je tijekom povijesti uglavnom smatran politeističkom religijom. Njegovi sljedbenici vide ga kao pluralističku religiju, smatrajući da svaka osoba ima jedinstven odnos s Bogom (Brahmanom). Bez obzira na pojavnost, oblik u kojem ga štujemo, Bog je samo jedan. Postoje tri božanska principa kroz koje se Bog manifestira: Brahma (stvarateljski princip), Višnu (održavateljski princip) i Šiva (uništavateljski princip - uništenje radi ponovnog stvaranja).

Ti zvuči poznato ovo boldano?
Vjerojatno on to i zna, no kako mu je jedini cilj popljuvati sve što nije njemu po volji i razlikuje se od vjerovanja njegove sekte, namjerno to zanemaruje.
Sektaš si ti,,moja vjera je kršćanstvo,,u nedjelju sam bio na misi,,katoličkoj,crkva Svetog Jakova,,Opatija.U drugu nedjelju ću u Baptističku crkvu,,

lol, patriote, opet se brukaš...

prvo, da li uopće znaš što pojam sekta znači pošto koristiš taj pojam jer koliko vidim opet mlatiš praznu slamu.

p.s. kršćanstvo je nastalo kao židovska sekta, a iako se odvojilo i dalje ima elemente sekte. no važno je napomenuti da u kršćanstvu ima ohoho sekti, pogotovo u protestantizmu....

prvo ti nama patriote obrazloži pojam sekta, a onda nastavi dalje...

p.s. možda da pokušaš sa nekršćanskim stranicama....

by Patriot_1 4/7/2014, 13:07

Trinity wrote:Nedjeljom samo u 10?

Ši!
Odi,,baš me zanima tvoja impresija!

by Patriot_1 4/7/2014, 13:09

Trinity wrote:
Patriot_1 wrote:
Trinity wrote:Ok, ovako napisano izgleda bezazleno. Mene zanima kako oni žive u praksi, kakvi su prema drugim religijama, i da...ono o ženama...onako je kako je bogomdani napisao?
Prijatelj mi je novinar,radio neku reportažu u Indiji,napravio grdnu grešku,poveo ženu!U par navrata imao gadnu frku,likovi ju zgrabe I ljube,,,u usta(MEDNA),,jedva ju obranio da ju ne siluju,,usred grada!Krava je tamo,vrednija od žene!
A ništa onda, sav moj interes za hinduizam tu prestaje...

No,,,mi kršćani vjerujemo u jednog Boga,,,oni u stotine bogova,mi vjerujemo u vječni život , oni u reinkarnaciju,,,nema tu sličnosti!

by Guest 4/7/2014, 13:13

Patriot_1 wrote:No,,,mi kršćani vjerujemo u jednog Boga,,,oni u stotine bogova,mi vjerujemo u vječni život , oni u reinkarnaciju,,,nema tu sličnosti!

Vezano uz ove stotine bogova u hinduizmu, evo, kopiram opet:

Vegvísir wrote:Koncept Boga. Hinduizam je tijekom povijesti uglavnom smatran politeističkom religijom. Njegovi sljedbenici vide ga kao pluralističku religiju, smatrajući da svaka osoba ima jedinstven odnos s Bogom (Brahmanom). Bez obzira na pojavnost, oblik u kojem ga štujemo, Bog je samo jedan. Postoje tri božanska principa kroz koje se Bog manifestira: Brahma (stvarateljski princip), Višnu (održavateljski princip) i Šiva (uništavateljski princip - uništenje radi ponovnog stvaranja).

Jako slično kršćanskom konceptu.

by Guest 4/7/2014, 13:51

I ovo da bude zanavijek jasno...da ne bude zabune kad pišem kršćanstvo...postoji kršćanstvo i kršćanstvo, a ono istinsko sigurno nije ovo što ga zagovaraju u biti bezbožni militaristi kao Patriot i Michael. Kude sve i svašta, lažu o svemu mogućem, a štuju Trojstvo, ideju koja je hinduističkog prijekla, a isti oblik kakav je našla u kršćanstvu već je zacrtao Platon. Dakle, što čini neznanje i obmana...i samoobmana...

by Sefirot 4/7/2014, 14:01

Patriot_1 wrote:
Trinity wrote:
Patriot_1 wrote:
Trinity wrote:Ok, ovako napisano izgleda bezazleno. Mene zanima kako oni žive u praksi, kakvi su prema drugim religijama, i da...ono o ženama...onako je kako je bogomdani napisao?
Prijatelj mi je novinar,radio neku reportažu u Indiji,napravio grdnu grešku,poveo ženu!U par navrata imao gadnu frku,likovi ju zgrabe I ljube,,,u usta(MEDNA),,jedva ju obranio da ju ne siluju,,usred grada!Krava je tamo,vrednija od žene!
A ništa onda, sav moj interes za hinduizam tu prestaje...
No,,,mi kršćani vjerujemo u jednog Boga,,,oni u stotine bogova,mi vjerujemo u vječni život , oni u reinkarnaciju,,,nema tu sličnosti!

Toliko o poznavanju... pih.

hinduizam je naziv za više vjerskih pravaca na području Indije. Neki su monoteisti, neki politeisti. Neki u svom sustavu imaju reinkarnaciju neki ne. A da imalo poznaješ komparativnu religiologiju, ali imalo, našao bi ohoho slilčnosti.

kao i obično.... pričaš gluposti...

by Sefirot 4/7/2014, 14:02

Vegvísir wrote:
Patriot_1 wrote:No,,,mi kršćani vjerujemo u jednog Boga,,,oni u stotine bogova,mi vjerujemo u vječni život , oni u reinkarnaciju,,,nema tu sličnosti!

Vezano uz ove stotine bogova u hinduizmu, evo, kopiram opet:

Vegvísir wrote:Koncept Boga. Hinduizam je tijekom povijesti uglavnom smatran politeističkom religijom. Njegovi sljedbenici vide ga kao pluralističku religiju, smatrajući da svaka osoba ima jedinstven odnos s Bogom (Brahmanom). Bez obzira na pojavnost, oblik u kojem ga štujemo, Bog je samo jedan. Postoje tri božanska principa kroz koje se Bog manifestira: Brahma (stvarateljski princip), Višnu (održavateljski princip) i Šiva (uništavateljski princip - uništenje radi ponovnog stvaranja).

Jako slično kršćanskom konceptu.

Đabe mu govoriš, ne razumije ti on komparativnu religiologiju... ako druga religija nema Isusa u sebi... onda ne vrijedi.... lol :^0

by Guest 5/7/2014, 20:37

Trinity je pitala za status žena u hinduizmu, pa evo (kasnije ću dodati i nešto o braku kod hindusa).

According to Hinduism, the female was created by Brahman as part of the duality in creation, to provide company to men and facilitate procreation, progeny and continuation of family lineage.

Vedas on women

The Vedas suggest that a woman's primary duty is to help her husband in performing obligatory duties and enable him to continue his family tradition. Her primary duty is to give birth to his children and take care of them.Like all the major religions of the world, Hinduism is a predominantly male dominated religion.

Division of duties

This is evident from the division of duties prescribed by the scriptures between a man and a woman. A husband has wider obligatory duties than his wife. In fact, the Vedic ceremonies and sacrifices revolve around men. They are performed by men for men. If women are involved, it is usually for conception or procreation where again the emphasis is upon male children.Women cannot officiate in any Vedic ceremony. They may perform domestic rituals such as pooja or perform austerities, but the host of a sacrifice is always a male member.

Respect for women

On the brighter side, Hindus worship many female deities, as aspects of Mother Goddess and consorts of male gods.The law books prohibit men from harassing or neglecting women in thief households. It is man's obligatory duty to protect his wife and take care of her until the end.He is not expected to abandon her, since she is a gift from gods under a pledge, except where there was sufficient justification such as mental illness, inability to bear children and adultery.Similarly, he has an obligation to take care of his aged mother or his dependent daughter.Women are considered aspects of Nature or embodiment of Universal Mother, Shakti, in her aspect as pure energy (shaktiswarupini). She is extolled as mata, the Mother Goddess, or devi the auspicious one.

Limited freedom in a dependent status

On the other hand, as per tradition, a woman has limited freedom. She is a dependent entity, in a household dominated by male members.As a young child, she lives under the protection of her father or guardians. As a wife she lives under the protection of her husband and acts as his partner, advisor and helper. As a mother she nurtures her children and shapes their destiny. Women like Sita, Satyavati, Draupadi, Ganga, Kunti, Shakuntala, Menaka, Amba, Anasuya, Damayanti, played an important role in exemplifying the ideal conduct of women in private and in public.They also exemplify the hardships faced by women in ancient times. Even, Sita, an incarnation of goddess Lakshmi, the queen of Rama, had to bear the brunt of gender discrimination and public ire.Tradition recommends four prominent roles for a married Hindu woman: that of a servant (dasi), that of an advisor or counselor (mantri), that of a mother (mata) and that of a lover (rambha).

The plight of widows

In some communities in the past, upon the death of their husbands women performed sati and self-immolated themselves on the funeral pyres of their husbands. This practice is currently banned.Others, who lost their husbands, lived in seclusion or under the care of their sons or close relations. In either case, the life of a widow was a life of severe hardship.The hardships and suffering increased proportionately in case of younger widows. Premature death of a man was attributed to his wife. If a man died early, his close relations pointed their fingers at his wife for bringing misfortune upon the family.

Social issues

Historically, the status of women in India was ambiguous. In theory, she had many privileges andenjoyed an exalted status as an aspect of goddess.But in practice, most women led miserable lives as servants to their husbands. In the past, until the independence, Hindu men had the freedom to marry more than one wife or keep mistresses.Prominent members of society such as landlords, merchants, ministers, high ranking officials, scribes and poets visited prostitutes and felt no qualms about it.At the same time, household women were kept in confinement as per the injunctions of the law books, which stipulated that a woman should not meet any men outside her family without a family member present.

Bias in Hindu law books

The law books are unabashedly male-centric. They do suggest that women should not be harassed and the homes in which women suffered would be without peace and happiness.In the same vein, they prescribe many restrictive conditions for women and curtail their freedom.A modern Hindu woman would feel enraged, rightly so, if she goes through the contents of the Manusmriti, which is particularly discriminatory and harsh against women.It is true that the law books were not followed by many castes and their enforcement was limited by the authority and influence the kings and local rulers enjoyed.In general, Hindu women from the lower castes enjoyed much greater freedom than the women in the households of higher castes.Many girls were married off at an early age to relatively older men and the life of such women when they reached puberty was full of hardship.

Current situation

The situation is gradually changing. It is difficult to draw generalizations about the status of present day Hindu women because the society is complex.In general, life in cities is much different from life in the rural areas. Those who live abroad live in different conditions than those who live in the country. Yet, we have ample indications that women are still subject to many restrictions and disabilities in rural areas as well as urban areas.The financial independence of women and the education levels of the family play an important role in this regard.Women in urban areas face numerous challenges in their professions and personal lives. But overall, life is better for them compared to the past. Love marriages outside caste or community are scorned and sometimes the couple are killed or excommunicated by the elders in the family or villages. Widows can now have a life of their own and even remarry. They draw a lot of sympathy. But discrimination continues since they are not treated in the same manner as married women during rituals and family functions. The marriage customs have also undergone change. There are now age restrictions on marriage. Women enjoy a great say in their marriage matters. The law gives them clear assurances as to their rights and freedom.

Problems faced by present day Hindu women

However, Hindu women have a long way to go to enjoy an equal status with men. They have to cope with many social and economic pressures and resolve many problems that afflict their lives today such as the following.

1. Dowry problem, which is acute in certain castes and communities

2. Parental interference in marriage and career matters

3. Domestic violence and abuse

4. Violence against women which often goes unreported

5. Bride burning and dowry deaths

6. Gender based abortions

7. Gender inequality in the treatment of children

8. Dwindling sex ratio. Sex ratio in many parts of India has fallen considerably in the last few decades due to gender discrimination. According to a recent UN sponsored report (2013), it may take not less than 50 years for a state like Haryana to return to the natural state of sex ratio.

9. Women trafficking. According to the same UN sponsored report (2013) female feticide worsened the sex ratio in Haryana to such an extent that it has led to the trafficking of women from various parts of India to that state where they are turned into domestic workers or forcibly married against their will. Girls who are forced into such marriages against their will are called "Paro."

10. Sale of women. Every year, hundreds of women and young girls are either bartered or sold into sex trade or modern form of slavery

Conclusion

Women in Hindu families have a long way to go before they can consider themselves truly free. Many Hindu men still entertain a traditional mindset and view women with sexist and judgmental attitude. The Indian movies reflect the attitude of an average Indian male towards women in general. Until that undergoes transformation, women may continue struggle under the weight of traditions, oppression of men, social and economic discrimination and the compulsions of modern life.

Dakle, bez uljepšavanja, realno stanje je dosta nepogodno za žene, patrijarhalni odnosi su i dalje jaki, izazov vremena ipak čini svoje... U teoriji su zaštićene od svake vrste nasilja i ponižavanja, no i dalje podložne muškarcima...

by Trinity 5/7/2014, 21:09

In some communities in the past, upon the death of their husbands women performed sati and self-immolated themselves on the funeral pyres of their husbands. This practice is currently banned.Others, who lost their husbands, lived in seclusion or under the care of their sons or close relations. In either case, the life of a widow was a life of severe hardship.The hardships and suffering increased proportionately in case of younger widows. Premature death of a man was attributed to his wife. If a man died early, his close relations pointed their fingers at his wife for bringing misfortune upon the family.

Sjećam se nekih filmova koji su prikazivali spaljivanje udovica. Mučno.

Izgleda da kako stvari stoje trebat će još puuuno vremena da se situacija popravi za žene.

by Guest 5/7/2014, 21:12

Trinity wrote:
Sjećam se nekih filmova koji su prikazivali spaljivanje udovica. Mučno.

Da, vrlo okrutan običaj, danas zabranjen. Zanimljivo da je postojao i kod Slavena, jedan slučaj je zapisao jedan arapski putopisac.

by Trinity 5/7/2014, 21:14

Do kada je taj običaj bio kod Slavena?

by Guest 5/7/2014, 21:17

Trinity wrote:Do kada je taj običaj bio kod Slavena?

Kod Rusa je zabilježen u 10. stoljeću, dakle netom prije pokrštavanja (oni su najduže ostali vjerni paganizmu među Slavenima uopće).

by Sefirot 7/7/2014, 09:21

von_Starhemberg wrote:Trinity je pitala za status žena u hinduizmu, pa evo (kasnije ću dodati i nešto o braku kod hindusa).

According to Hinduism, the female was created by Brahman as part of the duality in creation, to provide company to men and facilitate procreation, progeny and continuation of family lineage.

Vedas on women

The Vedas suggest that a woman's primary duty is to help her husband in performing obligatory duties and enable him to continue his family tradition. Her primary duty is to give birth to his children and take care of them.Like all the major religions of the world, Hinduism is a predominantly male dominated religion.
.....

Conclusion

Women in Hindu families have a long way to go before they can consider themselves truly free. Many Hindu men still entertain a traditional mindset and view women with sexist and judgmental attitude. The Indian movies reflect the attitude of an average Indian male towards women in general. Until that undergoes transformation, women may continue struggle under the weight of traditions, oppression of men, social and economic discrimination and the compulsions of modern life.

Dakle, bez uljepšavanja, realno stanje je dosta nepogodno za žene, patrijarhalni odnosi su i dalje jaki, izazov vremena ipak čini svoje... U teoriji su zaštićene od svake vrste nasilja i ponižavanja, no i dalje podložne muškarcima...

Pa zapravo i nije daleko od islamskih ili pak kršćanskih ideja i tradicija. To što su žene slobodnije i imaju više prava na zapadu se može zahvaliti samo i isključivo samo sekularnosti i obrazovanju...a ne vjerskoj ideologiji i doktrini.

by Bran_Do 7/7/2014, 13:57

Patriot_1 wrote:Hinduizam je smeće!Imaju bogova vise nego grobova!A Bog je jedan i jedini!Ili bolje,,,trojedan!

Imaju i nemaju.
Jer svi njihovi bogovi zapravo predstavljaju neki aspekt/emanaciju Jednog Boga. Barem je tako u mainstream hinduizmu, makar je hinduizam vrlo kompleksan pojam koji se ne može jednoobrazno razmatrati i definirati.

Zapravo se mnogi njihovi "bogovi" mogu po mnogome usporediti s našim katoličkim svecima, naročito u svjetlu sličnosti u pristupu (molitve svecima, itd.).

by Patriot_1 8/7/2014, 09:09

Bran_Do wrote:
Patriot_1 wrote:Hinduizam je smeće!Imaju bogova vise nego grobova!A Bog je jedan i jedini!Ili bolje,,,trojedan!

Imaju i nemaju.
Jer svi njihovi bogovi zapravo predstavljaju neki aspekt/emanaciju Jednog Boga. Barem je tako u mainstream hinduizmu, makar je hinduizam vrlo kompleksan pojam koji se ne može jednoobrazno razmatrati i definirati.

Zapravo se mnogi njihovi "bogovi" mogu po mnogome usporediti s našim katoličkim svecima, naročito u svjetlu sličnosti u pristupu (molitve svecima, itd.).

Koliko Hinduizam kao vjera ima veze sa kastama?Postoje li one zahvaljujući njemu?

by Bran_Do 8/7/2014, 09:46

Patriot_1 wrote:Koliko Hinduizam kao vjera ima veze sa kastama?Postoje li one zahvaljujući njemu?

Ako ćemo gledati porijeklo kastinskog sustava, on ne proizlazi iz hinduizma kao takvog.

"Sredinom 2.tisućljeća prije Krista, oko 1500. godine prije Krista, Arijci, jedan od indoeuropskih naroda, prodiru na područje indijskog potkontinenta. Arijci su, iako malobrojni, imali nadmoć: brončani mač i brza bojna kola. Uspostavljaju dominaciju nad sjedilačkim stanovništvom Dravida, dovode na indijsko tlo indoeuropski jezik sanskrt, te, da bi očuvali osvajači identitet vlastitog naroda u odnosu na pokorene Dravide, uspostavljaju kruti društveni poredak zasnovan na podjeli prema boji kože, položaju u društvu, bogatstvu, zanimanju i vjeri. Iz te podjele indijskog pučanstva na kaste nazire se da je tu upravo riječ o ekonomsko-društvenom procesu diobe rada, koji se odigrao u jednom primitivnom društvu, a pod utjecajem povlašćivanja jednih društvenih grupa po drugima."

Izvor: Wiki

by Patriot_1 8/7/2014, 12:29

Bran_Do wrote:
Patriot_1 wrote:Koliko Hinduizam kao vjera ima veze sa kastama?Postoje li one zahvaljujući njemu?

Ako ćemo gledati porijeklo kastinskog sustava, on ne proizlazi iz hinduizma kao takvog.

"Sredinom 2.tisućljeća prije Krista, oko 1500. godine prije Krista, Arijci, jedan od indoeuropskih naroda, prodiru na područje indijskog potkontinenta. Arijci su, iako malobrojni, imali nadmoć: brončani mač i brza bojna kola. Uspostavljaju dominaciju nad sjedilačkim stanovništvom Dravida, dovode na indijsko tlo indoeuropski jezik sanskrt, te, da bi očuvali osvajači identitet vlastitog naroda u odnosu na pokorene Dravide, uspostavljaju kruti društveni poredak zasnovan na podjeli prema boji kože, položaju u društvu, bogatstvu, zanimanju i vjeri. Iz te podjele indijskog pučanstva na kaste nazire se da je tu upravo riječ o ekonomsko-društvenom procesu diobe rada, koji se odigrao u jednom primitivnom društvu, a pod utjecajem povlašćivanja jednih društvenih grupa po drugima."

Izvor: Wiki

Hvala na odgovoru,,
Drugo pitanje,,Romi potječu iz Indije,,a po moralu baš i nisu nešto,,no oni su odavno izgubili svoju vjeru,(Hindu),,koliko mentalitet Roma jest slika mentaliteta Indijaca?
Koliko znam,,,tamo je Ciganarija(glede naroda)!

by Guest 8/7/2014, 12:50

Vrijedi isto što sam napisala o na temi Religija i tolerancija. Držite se teme bez profiliranja i vrijeđanja jedni drugih. Brišem spam.

by Bran_Do 8/7/2014, 12:54

Patriot_1 wrote:Hvala na odgovoru,,
Drugo pitanje,,Romi potječu iz Indije,,a po moralu baš i nisu nešto,,no oni su odavno izgubili svoju vjeru,(Hindu),,koliko mentalitet Roma jest slika mentaliteta Indijaca?
Koliko znam,,,tamo je Ciganarija(glede naroda)!

Zapravo, vrlo malo jer dugoročno je mentalitet naroda oblikovan prošlošću, odnosno okolnostima pod kojima je neka skupina živjela u duljem ili kraćem razdoblju.

Neke odlike romskog naroda koje smatramo negativnima, ali i one pozitivne, zapravo su rezultat nomadskog (seobenog) načina života i svega što prati takav način života.
Za usporedbu, beduini su također nomadi i dijele mnoge slične karakteristike s Romima, iako nisu po porijeklu bliski s njima.

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